Have you read about Elan School? If not, you should. It is indicative of what those nature programs are like. It is chilling and highly disturbing. The kids are not allowed to communicate accurately to the parents the abuse that is happening.
Edit: I should have mentioned, massive content warning. Kidnapping, child abuse, specifically, recruiting older children to perpetuate further verbal and physical abuse to the younger children, sleep deprivation, it goes on and on.
Sorryyyyyy I also regret reading the whole thing when I did years ago. I did put a content warning after a few minutes though. It is horrible but also strangely compelling to read.
The later half (around chapter 65ish), Joe’s life gets a lot better when he finally graduates and turns 18. He still has a lot of lingering issues and trouble adjusting to life after Elan, but he eventually builds a future for himself. Although, he does keep tabs on/in touch with other survivors and they all have various issues ranging from PTSD to drug addiction.
What’s more, not only do schools like Elan continue to this day, there are thousands of Native Americans subjected to similar abuse in residential schools across North America. The last of them didn’t close until the '90s in Canada. It was widespread and systemically supported by multiple governments. “Kill the Indian, save the Christian” was their motto.
Absolutely horrifying what children are subjected to because they’re seen as property to be bought and sold, not the people they actually are.
If I recall, even he’s not sure how it happened, but he believes it’s because the guy who ran Elan was probably well connected with other local intitutions and could contact them to look for him
him suddenly turning to religion after that experience isn’t too surprising though. i’d be goddamn terrified if they somehow found me that far away. Hell, when he introduced me to the drifter in the van, I was sure that the guy actually worked for Elan and went out there just to grab him and take him back
Yeah same, definitely broke my brain and I don’t know that anything other than everyone who ever ran one of these places being redacted will ever fix it
I have no words. Death to America, Death to Australia, Death to the Empire (she repeats to herself like a centering mantra almost devoid of meaning at this point.)
Yes. The troubled teen industry is abusive, period. These are not evidence based programs, they are torture centers following a made up therapy invented by cultists. That’s literally what “troubled teen program” means in the USA. If you look at the link OP posted, this particular case was a “wilderness school” in Utah - that’s not at all ambiguous or possibly legitimate. His parents paid for him to be abused as a child.
Never think anything that begins with “The rich can’t be depraved enough to…” is true, even if the second half of that sentence is “…send their own children to torture camps.”
Why are you so unwilling to accept the well documented abuses of troubled teen camps? Have you done any research into this subject before coming in here and going “NUH-UH”" to everyone giving you an explanation?
I didn’t mean for this to become a dogpile on you like it did. Sorry for that. But you need to educate yourself on this topic.
I don’t think Robert Reiner knew how bad the programs are. He seems like a decent guy. But yes, it is that bad, nearly across the board. Teen corrections is a 50 billion dollar industry in the US. Other countries don’t have that kind of cottage industry, and ours is uniquely bad, but also that isn’t completely common knowledge yet, or certainly was less known back when he was sent.
Also, Utah and Nevada and states like it are commonly chosen for these things because child abuse protections are/were more lenient in those states. Under 18 years old Gay/trans conversion therapy was still allowed in Nevada until 2017.
I don’t think Robert Reiner knew how bad the programs are.
Unfortunately this seems like it’s typical, with parents never coming to terms with what they put their kids through because they thought it was going to help them. The kids are punished by the people running the program if they don’t pretend they’re happy and the program is going well, etc.
2020 in Utah, and that by governor executive order after the legislature wouldn’t do it. Didn’t become actual law to ban conversion therapy on minors in Utah until 2023.
And I really shudder to think what still goes on among the religious population there who think they get their laws from god.
Have you read about Elan School? If not, you should. It is indicative of what those nature programs are like. It is chilling and highly disturbing. The kids are not allowed to communicate accurately to the parents the abuse that is happening.
https://elan.school/
Edit: I should have mentioned, massive content warning. Kidnapping, child abuse, specifically, recruiting older children to perpetuate further verbal and physical abuse to the younger children, sleep deprivation, it goes on and on.
damn i shouldn’t have read all that. or i should have. terrible but eye opening and now my day is ruined
Sorryyyyyy I also regret reading the whole thing when I did years ago. I did put a content warning after a few minutes though. It is horrible but also strangely compelling to read.
Oh absolutely. I feel like I’m getting PTSD just by reading this and I can’t stop reading it
spoiler
i genuinely thought it was going to end once he made it to Brooklyn. Silly me🙃
Yeah you really should take breaks with that story. It is A LOT for one sitting.
fucking hell it just keeps fucking going. I thought I was nearly done by chapter 52 and i checked and there’s 100 of these wtf
It’s so compelling. I can’t stop. I hope it was life changingly cathartic for Joe to create this amazing piece of work.
The later half (around chapter 65ish), Joe’s life gets a lot better when he finally graduates and turns 18. He still has a lot of lingering issues and trouble adjusting to life after Elan, but he eventually builds a future for himself. Although, he does keep tabs on/in touch with other survivors and they all have various issues ranging from PTSD to drug addiction.
What’s more, not only do schools like Elan continue to this day, there are thousands of Native Americans subjected to similar abuse in residential schools across North America. The last of them didn’t close until the '90s in Canada. It was widespread and systemically supported by multiple governments. “Kill the Indian, save the Christian” was their motto.
Absolutely horrifying what children are subjected to because they’re seen as property to be bought and sold, not the people they actually are.
spoiler
I’m frightened to consider how the hell they managed to find him. How’d they know he was in Brooklyn, much less specifically where in Brooklyn?
spoiler
If I recall, even he’s not sure how it happened, but he believes it’s because the guy who ran Elan was probably well connected with other local intitutions and could contact them to look for him
him suddenly turning to religion after that experience isn’t too surprising though. i’d be goddamn terrified if they somehow found me that far away. Hell, when he introduced me to the drifter in the van, I was sure that the guy actually worked for Elan and went out there just to grab him and take him back
Yeah same, definitely broke my brain and I don’t know that anything other than everyone who ever ran one of these places being redacted will ever fix it
I have no words. Death to America, Death to Australia, Death to the Empire (she repeats to herself like a centering mantra almost devoid of meaning at this point.)
Oh yh there was the netflix doc cons, cults and kidnapping about these.
Fuck I thought I could handle this but I need to take a break jfc.
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Yes. The troubled teen industry is abusive, period. These are not evidence based programs, they are torture centers following a made up therapy invented by cultists. That’s literally what “troubled teen program” means in the USA. If you look at the link OP posted, this particular case was a “wilderness school” in Utah - that’s not at all ambiguous or possibly legitimate. His parents paid for him to be abused as a child.
deleted by creator
Alpha edition Black Lotus with the square corners and everything
Never think anything that begins with “The rich can’t be depraved enough to…” is true, even if the second half of that sentence is “…send their own children to torture camps.”
Why are you so unwilling to accept the well documented abuses of troubled teen camps? Have you done any research into this subject before coming in here and going “NUH-UH”" to everyone giving you an explanation?
deleted by creator
Do you think we’re being soft on him because of his social status?
I didn’t mean for this to become a dogpile on you like it did. Sorry for that. But you need to educate yourself on this topic.
I don’t think Robert Reiner knew how bad the programs are. He seems like a decent guy. But yes, it is that bad, nearly across the board. Teen corrections is a 50 billion dollar industry in the US. Other countries don’t have that kind of cottage industry, and ours is uniquely bad, but also that isn’t completely common knowledge yet, or certainly was less known back when he was sent.
Also, Utah and Nevada and states like it are commonly chosen for these things because child abuse protections are/were more lenient in those states. Under 18 years old Gay/trans conversion therapy was still allowed in Nevada until 2017.
Unfortunately this seems like it’s typical, with parents never coming to terms with what they put their kids through because they thought it was going to help them. The kids are punished by the people running the program if they don’t pretend they’re happy and the program is going well, etc.
2020 in Utah, and that by governor executive order after the legislature wouldn’t do it. Didn’t become actual law to ban conversion therapy on minors in Utah until 2023.
And I really shudder to think what still goes on among the religious population there who think they get their laws from god.
There have been exposes, damning investigation and lawsuits about basically all of the big ones.