Hi 👋 just shared the site with one of my buddies and he told me he doesn’t care much about it because there’s no way you’ll be 100% privacy enforced since you’re using an iPhone and sharing your location, name, birthdate , personal files, photos.

I’ve to say this gets to me but on the other side I’m also respectful of everyone‘s opinion because after all, this is what makes us special

How are you handling these circumstances usually, do you say something?

  • Ulrich@feddit.org
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    3 days ago

    Completely disagree. You can’t use iPhones with anything but iOS. And you can’t install any apps Apple hasn’t put their fucking rubber stamp and collected taxes on. For that reason, it is not and never will be viable. Not to mention being overpriced and disposable.

    Android may be created by an advertising company but they also give you the ability to run whatever OS you want and strip it of Google’s proprietary software completely. These days you can install OS like Graphene by simply plugging in your phone and clicking buttons in your browser.

    • River_Tahm@lemmy.today
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      2 days ago

      Graphene doesn’t completely strip Google software though, it sandboxes it. You still gotta use the play store to install most apps for example.

      • Ulrich@feddit.org
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        2 days ago

        I mean the entire thing is “Google software” so I’m not sure what you mean. It strips it of everything that calls Google’s servers. It has optional sandboxed Google Play services.

        You don’t need the Google Play Store, you can install all of those apps with Aurora Store.

        • River_Tahm@lemmy.today
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          I think the point is you’re exaggerating how easy it is for the average person to install and use something like Graphene - people are arguing it’s less that Google allows it and more that white hats have forced it and I don’t think that’s an unfair statement. Like - I’m techy, own a phone running Graphene, and will have to look into the Aurora store - hadn’t heard of it before this!

          Apple seems to be pretty privacy forward at the moment and it’s true that they sell hardware more so than software, and WAY moreso than user data. For people who can’t figure out something like Graphene, Apple is certainly a better choice than Googled Android. And I think that’s valuable to be able to tell people in this day and age even if Graphene would be best overall

          • Ulrich@feddit.org
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            2 days ago

            I think the point is you’re exaggerating how easy it is for the average person to install and use something like Graphene

            I’m not. It really is that easy.

            But the fact that it’s easy isn’t the point. The point is that you have that choice. That is not a choice you’re allowed with Apple.

            Apple is certainly a better choice than Googled Android. And I think that’s valuable to be able to tell people

            I did tell them that, in the parent comment of this thread.

            • guismo@aussie.zone
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              2 days ago

              As a GrapheneOS user, and someone who hates apple and would rather not have a phone than bend to apple, and while i agree with most of what you said, i would not expect the majority of the users to be able to install graphene. I don’t personally know anyone i would expect to be able to do by themselves. It’s easy for you. It wasn’t super easy for me, it would be difficult for most people.

              • Ulrich@feddit.org
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                2 days ago

                the fact that it’s easy isn’t the point. The point is that you have that choice.

                • guismo@aussie.zone
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                  2 days ago

                  I agree. It’s just that you said it’s easy.

                  Maybe you were referring to unlocking the phone, which is really easy on stock android if you know how.

                  The day we don’t have the choice anymore is the day i stop using android. Or smart phones at all if the alternative is apple.

                  • Ulrich@feddit.org
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                    2 days ago

                    Well. Agree to disagree. You literally just plug it in and push buttons in the browser. It’s that simple.

    • _cryptagion [he/him]@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      3 days ago

      Android may be created by an advertising company but they also give you the ability to run whatever OS you want and strip it of Google’s proprietary software completely. These days you can install OS like Graphene by simply plugging in your phone and clicking buttons in your browser.

      This is patently untrue, and a total misrepresentation of the facts. You can install other OSes on a rather small list of Android phones. Furthermore, while the user might just be clicking a few buttons, behind the scenes those buttons put into play a rather complex series of actions that break the protections put into place by Google and phone manufacturers to stop you from doing exactly that.

      Saying that Google gives you the ability to install other OSes is like saying Sony gives you the ability to install other OSes on the Playstation. It isn’t true, Google never gave you that ability, the technical wizardry of white hat hackers did.

      • Ulrich@feddit.org
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        3 days ago

        This is patently untrue, and a total misrepresentation of the facts.

        LOL what? No it isn’t.

        You can install other OSes on a rather small list of Android phones.

        How many iPhones can you install another OS on? That’s nothing to do with Android anyway, you’d have to talk to the OEMs and carriers about that, Google lets you do it on their phones.

        while the user might just be clicking a few buttons, behind the scenes those buttons put into play a rather complex series of actions that break the protections put into place by Google and phone manufacturers to stop you from doing exactly that.

        No, it doesn’t. You don’t know what you’re talking about.

        Saying that Google gives you the ability to install other OSes is like saying Sony gives you the ability to install other OSes on the Playstation.

        No, it’s not. There’s a toggle that Google put in the stock settings specifically for that purpose.

        • _cryptagion [he/him]@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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          3 days ago

          No, it doesn’t. You don’t know what you’re talking about.

          Kid, you’ve no fucking idea what I know, so stop with this adolescent shit. Your whole post is nothing more than you saying “nuh uh” to everything I wrote. If you’re going to argue about stuff, at least take the time to actually be fucking informed about what you’re talking about. I’ve been jailbreaking iPhones and taking apart Android since before you were old enough to even know what XDA is.

          • Ulrich@feddit.org
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            you’ve no fucking idea what I know,

            I know you know nothing about this.

            Your whole post is nothing more than you saying “nuh uh” to everything I wrote

            …and what do you think you wrote? I didn’t see any evidence? Get a Pixel (or other similarly unlockable device), go into the settings and look for the “OEM unlocking” toggle. There’s your evidence. Maybe you can learn something new today.

            I’ve been jailbreaking iPhones and taking apart Android since before you were old enough to even know what XDA is.

            You’ve no idea how old I am.

    • azalty@jlai.lu
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      2 days ago

      90%+ apps require Google play services, which basically allows them to know every app you use, and potentially more.

      There’s also a surge in apps implementing integrity checks, which makes you unable to run certain apps entirely with a custom ROM

      Google has the exact same policy of getting a large cut of each payment you make…

      • guismo@aussie.zone
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        2 days ago

        Just like Ulrich thinking installing graphene being easy is just his experience, that is just your experience. I don’t have a single app that needs google play and that’s one thing i find it easy.

        Whatever would need it i just use their website. Sure they try a lot to annoy you into using their useless app but it’s doable and becomes an incentive to find a better service.

        • azalty@jlai.lu
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          2 days ago

          You can find your way around, but you’ll spend twice the amount of time doing the same tasks that you could easily do on apps. Also, bye bye bank apps, or any Android games

          If you don’t use your phone a lot, understandable, but for most people, nah, not doable

          • guismo@aussie.zone
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            2 days ago

            I use my phone a lot lot. It’s a terrible addiction. But yeah, I’m not the usual user and my needs are different.

            But I disagree with “spending twice the amount of time”. I’ve never seen that except on evil stuff that just handicaps the website on mobile for no reason other than “I’ll force you to use my app through pain”, when the desktop site is as good or even better than the app. And if it’s one of those companies, to me it’s a red flag. It’s not a service I’m using, it’s a company trying to abuse me as far as they can and I’ll be dumb if I continue on that abusive relationship and not break up.

            But ending an abusive relationship is a personal choice. But to me they are inflicting that pain on them selves.

            Oh, a good example is reddit. The mobile website experience is painful for no reason other than to force me to use their shitty app to steal more from me.

            And what do you know? That was a red flag and that is a company I should have tried my best to avoid for that reason and many others. And now here I am on Lemmy, happier, and not forced a shitty app down my throat.

      • Ulrich@feddit.org
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        2 days ago

        No they don’t. More like 5%. What % of Apple apps require Apple services?

          • Ulrich@feddit.org
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            2 days ago

            Google gets 0% of income of apps installed outside of the Google Play Store.

            My 5% was referring to Google Play Services dependency.

            • azalty@jlai.lu
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              2 days ago

              and what % of apps are installed outside of the Google Play Store…?

              They push warning messages all over the OS to deter users from doing that…

              • Ulrich@feddit.org
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                and what % of apps are installed outside of the Google Play Store…?

                Why does that matter? The point is you can do it. Personally 100% of mine are installed that way using Aurora, Obtainium, Droidify or Accrescent. Android allows you that freedom and always has, Apple fights vigilantly to ensure you never have that choice.

                They push warning messages all over the OS to deter users from doing that…

                They are not “all over the OS”. There is a pop-up message that asks you if you want to allow the app to be used as an installer. That’s it.

                • azalty@jlai.lu
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                  2 days ago

                  If the point is that you can do it, then yea, you can also sideload apps on iOS. It’s an immense pain, limited to X apps, but you can, and you could technically pay with 0% fee…

                  They are not “all over the OS”. There is a pop-up message that asks you if you want to allow the app to be used as an installer. That’s it.

                  iirc there was more but alright

                  • Ulrich@feddit.org
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                    2 days ago

                    If you actually look into this, you really can’t. Yes, you can install alternative app stores but they still require Apple’s stamp of approval, they still require an Apple developer account, along with $100/yr subscriptions, and they still require “only” 27% cut of revenue, and all of that is only available in the EU.

    • Eugene V. Debs' Ghost@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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      Android may be created by an advertising company but they also give you the ability to run whatever OS you want and strip it of Google’s proprietary software completely. These days you can install OS like Graphene by simply plugging in your phone and clicking buttons in your browser.

      That’s like saying since computers come with Windows pre-installed, Microsoft gave you the ability to install Linux. Computers are agnostic to what runs on them, they’re inherently neutral unless made on the deeper level to prohibit side loading. Like a lot of Androids and all iPhones do.

      • Ulrich@feddit.org
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        2 days ago

        Microsoft gave you the ability to install Linux

        They don’t give you the ability but they also don’t actively impede you from installing something else. If computers were agnostic then you could install whatever you wanted on an iPhone but you can’t because Apple locks them down.