The thing is, you can’t predetermine if they’ll have cancer or some other rare conditions before existing. There’s very good screening tests nowadays to help prevent that as well. To me, it seems like a strange morality for that to be your reason to avoid having children. It’s anticipatory grief, like not making friends because they might die. By the same logic, what if your child is the one that discovers the cure to cancer? In that case, it’s cruel not to have them, but you can’t know, so it’s a moot point. Unless you do know, in which case send me a DM, I’m in need of a mystic.
Hereditary conditions are a whole different conversation.
@Zarobi the whole “my kid will be the smartestest and cure cancer” argument is why we are in the state we are in. That phrase is also often used by religious nutjobs.
The difference between “I shouldn’t make friends cuz they’ll just die” is easy: we are already here , against our will, so let’s make the best of it.
I counter with: your child could be Hitler 3.0, See how that point is just plain dumb? Every human thinks their special child will be the smartest and best next president.
The point is, it doesn’t matter. Most likely your child would be perfectly average and live a normal life. You can’t know for sure, so there’s no reason to worry about it. It’s the same as how you drive your car, even though you cannot guarantee an accident will not happen. You just do it anyway.
If you truly believe existence is not worth having, I’d actually treat that as a red flag to maybe talk to a professional about those feelings. This is not normally.
You think any kid born today is going to have : medical care, be able to own land/house, get any sort of job, not be mass surveilled, not be involved in climate disasters and water/food shortages? Thats the reason I don’t think its worth it. If we lived in a perfect utopia then maybe, for people who want it.
If I had to choose, I would 100% choose to be born even earlier at the very least, but I’m super lucky I still grew up in a golden age of sorts.
Yes. I believe that life will be worth living, even if it might look different in the future. There will always be struggle and suffering, but also beauty and joy. People had kids in the past during genocide, famine, drought, cruel regimes, civil unrest, war, natural disasters… But they did it anyway, because it’s still worth it.
The original context of this thread was the claim that bringing any child into this world is an act of cruelty and selfishness. I say it’s an act of love and wanting to share it with yet another person. Personal choices are their own thing, anyone can choose not to have kids as their own choice, that’s fine. I’m only arguing against calling every parent selfish, and every child doomed.
@Zarobi sure, thats a fine comparison in some ways. But for many of us, we HAVE TO drive because we are forced to (because of American society , for one), and many would prefer not to be forced to drive.
Ive always been a realist. I’m actually quite happy with my life, privileged as I am now because of luck and people I know. However I only feel sadness when I see more and more children being born who are very likely going to have awful lives compared to me.
The thing is, you can’t predetermine if they’ll have cancer or some other rare conditions before existing. There’s very good screening tests nowadays to help prevent that as well. To me, it seems like a strange morality for that to be your reason to avoid having children. It’s anticipatory grief, like not making friends because they might die. By the same logic, what if your child is the one that discovers the cure to cancer? In that case, it’s cruel not to have them, but you can’t know, so it’s a moot point. Unless you do know, in which case send me a DM, I’m in need of a mystic.
Hereditary conditions are a whole different conversation.
@Zarobi the whole “my kid will be the smartestest and cure cancer” argument is why we are in the state we are in. That phrase is also often used by religious nutjobs.
The difference between “I shouldn’t make friends cuz they’ll just die” is easy: we are already here , against our will, so let’s make the best of it.
I counter with: your child could be Hitler 3.0, See how that point is just plain dumb? Every human thinks their special child will be the smartest and best next president.
The point is, it doesn’t matter. Most likely your child would be perfectly average and live a normal life. You can’t know for sure, so there’s no reason to worry about it. It’s the same as how you drive your car, even though you cannot guarantee an accident will not happen. You just do it anyway.
If you truly believe existence is not worth having, I’d actually treat that as a red flag to maybe talk to a professional about those feelings. This is not normally.
@Zarobi ran out of chars…
You think any kid born today is going to have : medical care, be able to own land/house, get any sort of job, not be mass surveilled, not be involved in climate disasters and water/food shortages? Thats the reason I don’t think its worth it. If we lived in a perfect utopia then maybe, for people who want it.
If I had to choose, I would 100% choose to be born even earlier at the very least, but I’m super lucky I still grew up in a golden age of sorts.
Yes. I believe that life will be worth living, even if it might look different in the future. There will always be struggle and suffering, but also beauty and joy. People had kids in the past during genocide, famine, drought, cruel regimes, civil unrest, war, natural disasters… But they did it anyway, because it’s still worth it.
The original context of this thread was the claim that bringing any child into this world is an act of cruelty and selfishness. I say it’s an act of love and wanting to share it with yet another person. Personal choices are their own thing, anyone can choose not to have kids as their own choice, that’s fine. I’m only arguing against calling every parent selfish, and every child doomed.
@Zarobi sure, thats a fine comparison in some ways. But for many of us, we HAVE TO drive because we are forced to (because of American society , for one), and many would prefer not to be forced to drive.
Ive always been a realist. I’m actually quite happy with my life, privileged as I am now because of luck and people I know. However I only feel sadness when I see more and more children being born who are very likely going to have awful lives compared to me.