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What we need to do is stop viewing men and women as separate entities that require different expectations and treatment. Hell, we should probably just chuck the entire construct of gender out the window as it serves no real purpose other than to pit groups of people against each other.
We can admit there are differences in biology, sex, and cultural expectations rather than live in fantasy land and paint with a brush so broad it covers literally everyone in existence.
How about we treat groups as individuals. Whether that be a man or woman. Chances are the problems effecting most men are issues other men face. Women that only women face. Then some that everyone does.
I’m my experience the only problems that affect any specific gender are either tied directly to biology or, much more commonly, are problems that we ourselves create because we insist on a difference between genders.
They’re both linked intrinsically as we’re both saying though.
I’d argue that the difference culture makes between genders is rooted way more in biology than we people to give credit for. So much of who a person is relies on a the genetic roll of the dice and a lot less on how we’re raised, who are parents are, etc. While they absolutely have influences, it’s just way less than we link to think it is. Separated twin studies have shown this time and again.
Also, testosterone and estrogen are a hell of a drug.
The concept of gender derives from biological sex, so yeah they’re linked. But, beyond being a convenient way to different genitals, gender doesn’t really provide any positive influence to society. It’s most often used as a way to reconcile differences between people and discriminate them into an identifiable group.
I think this is absolutely the way to go for future generations (think genderless preschools/kindergartens) but I really don’t think we can just flip a switch and undo millennia of gendered expectations. Although I really do appreciate the folks that try.
I think it’s extreme to say gender is inherently bad.
Totally. Gender can be pretty neat when you’re not being oppressed by it and have the freedom to pursue your own identity
but I really don’t think we can just flip a switch and undo millennia of gendered expectations.
Psychedelics make the brain flexible and this facilitates rapid cultural change.
How you gonna sell makeup and purses and shit unless they think they are not pretty? Gotta get them to sexualize themselves then get them to doubt their inherent beauty so they buy your products.
How you gonna sell guns and trucks and shit unless they think they are not manly.
https://music.youtube.com/watch?v=CgeEEFpnvZA&si=IdTezv7Mtjd1e1nK
I fully agree with your… Vibe?
But honestly there are differences between the sexes and genders and we shouldn’t just ignore those. Especially not with gender roles still being so embedded and most people being raised/coded with them.
I grew up a hetero normative male and that shit is hard to let go of, even tho I’m definitely not straight and love queer stuff. Escaping that “programming” can be scary AF.
I’m more than happy to raise a new generation free of gender roles, but let’s not forget those that were raised with them.
Yeah, it’s definitely not something that is even remotely easy to change and it would probably take several generations to do so. I think it starts with separating the two concepts and recognizing that for the most part the differences are tied to sex, not gender. Also, I think it’s perfectly fine for people to identify with a gender, but to tie the entire perception of them to the gender is where all the problems arise. Though maybe that necessarily complicates things.
Doesn’t need to be anything as wild as peyote. Just get some psilocybin, some pals you haven’t seen in a while, and have a talk. You’ll come out of that with a deeper understanding of yourself. Fact is, for every toxic man that needs to do soul searching, there’s a toxic woman. Perhaps, instead of pointing the finger at the opposite sex/gender/whatever, take people on a case by case basis. If they’re important to you in your life, you can be the catalyst that causes them to take the first step towards self improvement. Empathy is extremely important.
Can I just realize I am a human with weaknesses and strengths, loves and hates, bias and judgements but knows that if I am aware that the judgements and bias are there that I can set them aside to be fair to all when needed?
I don’t really want to do drugs, even if they will open my brain to the universe. I’m not ready to deal with my shit right now. I’d rather just be nice to everyone except obvious assholes, who I will just keep at a distance for my own sake.
Nope strong psychedelics are mandatory now.
But seriously I am not by any means advocating psychedelics as any sort of solution to anything. My own experiences with psychedelics have not always been good and if folks don’t think it’s right for them they should absolutely trust that feeling.
I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they’ve always worked for me.
- Hunter S Thompson
I didn’t really develop a personality of my own until I went balls deep into psychedelics and dissociatives in my 20’s, and even then it wasn’t until I started having “bad” experiences. That first bad LSD trip was rough, but it changed how I saw myself and my place in the world in a fundamental way. So many molecules, so many memories.
I can deeply relate with this! The most extreme “bad” trip I ever had completely changed the way I saw my life.
I was headed down a bad road, and had become content with my shitty lot in life. That trip made me face the fact that I was unhappy and was going to continue become more and more unhappy until I did something about it.
Over a decade later, I am much happier with myself and my environment. Thank you LSD! You changed me life!
There are really no bad trips it’s “bad” because we are in denial of what is showing us, and that conflict creates the “bad trip”
A) False. I wasn’t “in denial” when I had my first legitimate bad trip. That’s what made it so cathartic. I was suddenly faced with thoughts and emotions I wasn’t even aware of.
B) That’s kind of a dumb thing to say: “There’s no such thing as a bad trip, but things can make a trip go bad.”?
If your set and setting send you into a bad place, that is the LITERAL definition of the phrase “bad trip”. Ergo, bad trips are a thing.
Thats like saying "there’s no such thing as - ‘contaminated water’. There’s water which is tainted by chemicals or inorganic compounds which creates ‘contaminated water’ ". How it came to be contaminated is irrelevant in that context. It’s still contaminated.
You’re gatekeeping a psychedelic experience, and for what?
Because they’re some 20yr old wannabe psychonaut with extremely limited experience with drugs or mental healthcare.
Dangerous advice. It is possible to have a psychotic break from psychedelics. But yes most bad trips are “difficult” or anxiety attacks rather than all bad.
It’s not advice it’s my opinion, but yeah no everyone has enough mental fortitude, so don’t take my experience as baseline.
There are difficult trips like you’re describing, where it’s unpleasant but there’s something to learn from it. And having the mindset you describe can remind you to look for the meaning in that kind of situation. But there are in fact truly bad trips, where there is no readeemable aspect of it, it’s just pure unnecessary suffering. And that’s not even getting to people who have a psychotic break
I’m sure there are plenty of good ways to get high, I smoked a lot of weed back in the day but I’d rather just be completely sober now.
I spent 32 years of my life sleeping horribly, my brain literally doesn’t tell my lungs to breathe, I got a CPAP at 32 and for the first time felt truly awake. It was probably the most clarifying feeling I’ve ever felt in my life. I don’t think I want to fuck with my brain now that I have it operating about as good as it ever will.
Sounds like you’ve already done the self realization bit, no need to do drugs
Drug-induced psychedelic experiences are certainly not the only path to self-reflection and developing deeper self-awareness (in fact, for some people, they may not have that effect at all). You’re ok to pass on the peyote if you don’t feel it would be beneficial.
Edit: I will say, though, that I think everyone should set trials to better understand themselves and push at their perceived limits and baselines. Drug-induced psychedelic experiences can be pretty accessible trials in this sense, again for some. Ain’t the only way, though.
And then go to prison for being in possession of “narcotics” with “intent to distribute” because the police tested a bag of kitty litter and determined there was a trace of illegal drugs in it so the whole thing is cataloged as $10,000,000,000 USD worth of hardcord drugs.
Never try hardcord drugs not even once
Peyote is gateway to Ethernet
Less ping 👌🚬
I’m not here for your fucking needs
Reminds me of the most recent Fargo episode
I don’t see how men being gentlemen and dealing with their inner demons are mutually exclusive
I do see peyote being the part that doesn’t fit in though…
Psychedelics can help you identify, understand, come to terms with accepting, and managing, the things about yourself you wouldn’t otherwise. That begets the healthy self aware gentleman
They can also mess you up even worse
So can anything. That doesn’t diminish the other arguments. Especially without per capita data on outcomes. If you have this attitude, you might be unaware of the scale of people that have at a minimum experimented one time with psychedelics. It’s exponentially greater than the number of people worse off. Booze on the other hand… definitely seen fun times go sideways… and that’s the type of thing you hear “we’ve all been there” … per capita booze and others def messed up more lives
Yeah, I don’t want to down play the effects that properly administered psychedelics seem to be having in clinical trials.
But I’ve got a couple buddies who lost themselves to drugs. Specifically thinking of a pair of close friends who fell off the rails in college after getting really into pot and then LSD. I don’t care how much people say it doesn’t meet the clinical definition of addictive, weed will get you hooked and make you a lethargic POS if you let it.
And so given the very niche usage of peyote, I would assume those who use it are more likely to fall into the latter type of drug users.
That said, if you’ve got scientific write ups you can link me to to the contrary, I’d love to learn more about it.
Psychedelic therapy has significantly helped me with my PTSD. What you’re talking about is self medication. Your friends are trying to find something they need. The problem isn’t the drugs, it’s the lack of support. It’s not like they were fine and suddenly got swallowed by drugs. Anyone doing a bunch of drugs of any kind has problems that they need help with.
I’m glad to hear that worked for you. I don’t know that I agree with everything you’ve said, but what You’ve said seems to have a logic basis. I do wish I’d been more mature and put together enough on my own end to help my buddies out back in the day.
But all of that aside and looping back the the original post, I do think the line “do peyote” implies a more recreational (as opposed to clinical) application of the drugs.
I think that there’s some missing context that peyote is generally ceremonial with a long history of being part of indigenous religious traditions.
I did psychedelics recreationally once and it was one of the worst experiences of my life, but I think it made be a better person. But generally, I strongly disagree with recreational use of psychedelics. It’s extremely dangerous to experiment with psychedelics without an understanding of what one is going in to. I don’t think that clinical is the only other option here. There are a lot of places inbetween. But yeah, anyone talking about recreationally going out to do peyote without a whole lot of mental preparation and support is playing with something pretty powerful and probably won’t have fun.
So if we’re talking about demographic data on peyote users, could you give a more specific characterization of the latter type? Do you mean people who frequently use other illicit drugs? What are some datapoints that would help describe the type of person you’re talking about (age, sex, level of education, income, ethnicity*, nationality*, frequency of use, etc.)?
*Relevant due to religious use under the American Indian Religious Freedom Act in the U.S.
Asking honestly to see what exists re: scientific write ups (though given the topic there are possible problems of under-reporting and selection bias). Found this to start from but haven’t dug into it yet.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/25187051/
If we’re talking about the possible benefits and pitfalls of drug-induced psychedelic experiences generally outside of clinical contexts, this is tricky, but here are some write-ups of interest you could start from. This is intended simply as a signpost.
https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/02698811231158245
https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpsyt.2022.831092/full
Everyone I know who’s says utter garbage like this is a mega-weed-junkie who’s ruined their life.
I’ve seen two friends lose themselves to weed, a drug that’s so utterly normalized nowadays. I don’t need to know what some other bullshit does to people.
You picked the wrong internet stranger to peddle your bullshit.
I’m a corporate executive. A provider. A law abiding citizen. After taking care of my family, I create jobs for other Americans and pay high wages to offshores employees. I volunteer. I’m a good neighbor.
Most of my peers and colleagues agree with my sentiment. Many of us would even credit having an open creative mind in part for our successes.
The only normalized drugs are alcohol, nicotine, and opiates. All of which KILL PEOPLE, 2 of which KILL OTHER PEOPLE (drunk driving and second hand smoke), and the other kills families and communities. They fund mega corporations, not small businesses.
You have friends that aren’t successful in typical ways and you judge them. Fine. Tell me about us junkies ruining people’s lives and killing people?
Now, I showed you mine. Tell me what substances you use, and your successes, and contributions to others. Or are you just a closed minded miserable cunt with nothing to offer but to tear others down for their differences from you?
Let’s go, your turn.
EDIT: I too am an AMD man.
EDIT 2: I didn’t need to be that aggro. I’m not triggered but I do feel strongly about my comments. I didn’t need the ad hominen at you, which was reactive on my part. I own my responsibility in that but if you want to communicate with people that you disagree with, in actual good faith, for the purpose of persuading their beliefs, that requires effort. You should learn the power of language. Junky is a word with a lot of power. I’ve lost friends to DEATH bc of real and addictive drugs like heroin. Don’t equivocate things you don’t understand.
Well, good for youuuuuuu
I have two friends with their lives ruined, which means infinity more to me than you
So you want drugs?
Please don’t do peyote. It’s endangered. Go drink a san Pedro cactus instead.
Unless you grew it yourself from seed. But san pedro grows way faster, is more legal, and more common/cheaper, so just a better option for most people
quickly checks, sees the cactus is from the Andes in South America and isn’t banned in Brazil
Guess I have something to gift myself this christmas now
🤩
Will that humble me like peyote?
Same active ingredient in both, mescaline.
Jesus Christ a lot of y’all are taking this way too seriously
did you pass out the psychedelics yet?
Yes, you are already on your trip.
I think I need another hit. Pass the toad.
Hear me out- what if we normalized bullet ant gloves?
Yeaaa, you go first, chief.
Bullet Ant Condoms
Sorry I missed the first time. Could you show me again?
I want painless death, not painful living
You want to become a man, don’t you?
Peyote definitely did not humble me
men bad women good
Is the vibe.
Maybe you need some peyote time
A what now? I thought i was capable of speaking English.
Honestly? Yeah, kinda.
Meh, I do think psychs should be legalized and do a ton myself, but this notion that all the shitty people in the world just need to have a good trip and they’ll be better is silly and dangerous.
Tripping can make you confront shitty things you’ve been doing if you’re a decent person, but it won’t make someone who’s a Nazi not a Nazi, it’ll just make them weirder and sometimes more sure that they’re enlightened and see the truth.
Source: have met Nazis and shit who love acid.
Agree 100% but ”humbled” is not the way to sell it.
How about “enlightened” or are we so deep in the ‘golden retriever male’ narrative that we’re actually not going to accept that some people are warriors just like others are shamans and others are carers?
Maybe whoever you really are is actually Kenough?
no I’m too square and scared of mind altering substances (my grasp on reality is already quite tenuous)
If that’s how you feel then I would recommend avoiding them, or if you did want to, proceeding with extreme cautious (very low doses).
If any family history of schizophrenia then definitely avoid.
Thanks, can. My partner is curious, so I’ll probably take a baby dose at some point.
I’m pretty attached to my sobriety. If not for the mostly emphatic accounts of people’s trips, I wouldn’t have any interest. It’s nice to hear a voice going a bit counter to that for once.
I’m pretty experienced so if either of you have any specific questions reply with them and I can do my best to answer.
I really want to emphasize starting with a low dose. You can always take more, but can’t take less. Any experience with mind altering substances at all? Alcohol, cannabis, etc? Not that they’re really comparable.
Remember set and setting too. You want to be in a good mindset, if you’ve had a bad day or are dwelling on something that’s making you stressed it’s best to reschedule. Also, if you’re on any medications make sure to google any interactions. And the setting. Be with people you trust in a comfortable, familiar environment.
Yeah plenty of experience with alcohol and cannabis. And my partner was a raver, so lots of experience with drugs there. Though nowadays we don’t even drink coffee, so our tolerances are probably in the toilet lol.
My ideal first trip would be one where I doubt if I’m even feeling anything, so very on board with starting on a low dose.
My ideal first trip would be one where I doubt if I’m even feeling anything,
In that case I’d recommend maybe 0.1g (whereas for a proper “feeling it” dose I’d say ~2g)
Alright! Sounds like I’ve got my trajectory plotted, thanks! Will try and remember to check back when I finally get around to it
Please do! Make sure you have a scale.
I can’t do hallucinogens anymore. Even ecstasy gives me a “bad trip”. I get all anxious and in my own head. I have to lock myself in a room by myself. I can’t smoke weed because it makes me super anxious. Micro-dosing is cool though.
“anymore”
What happened bro
I don’t know. I started smoking weed at like 12, and started taking acid and ecstasy at like 14 or 15. It used to be fun. I used to fucking love the way it made me feel. But somewhere around 19 or 20 weed started giving me really bad anxiety attacks. Hallucinogens started making me freak out. It is incredibly unpleasant and unfortunate. I know what it’s like to enjoy those things, but I just can’t anymore.
I went through a very similar experience. You aren’t alone.
Sorry to hear that bro, it seems worse than never having had it at all than to enjoy it for a while and then never be able to take it anymore.
all i want in life is a briefcase full of psychedelics,uppers downers, and all arounders like hunter s.
