For all the rapist defense rhetoric fucks out there in these comments, and there are a lot of you.
Circumstantial evidence is valid evidence. Let’s maybe consider that, maybe, just maybe, of at least 28 women coming forward, with one confirmed rape conviction, that he has raped multiple women/girls. Just fucking maybe. This isn’t about your brother’s/cousin’s/dude from high school’s crazy ex-wife with a brain tumor, it’s about the president of the United States, maybe hold it to a different standard and stop painting everything with the same brush.
This isn’t about your brother’s/cousin’s/dude from high school’s crazy ex-wife with a brain tumor, it’s about the president of the United States, maybe hold it to a different standard
In your scenarios, all of the plaintiffs are related to the accused in a similar way and would have a common incentive to make the accusation. That kind of situation naturally raises concerns about collusion or bias. By contrast, when multiple independent and unconnected individuals come forward with similar accusations, the evidentiary weight is very different. Courts recognize that corroboration from unrelated parties strengthens credibility, because it reduces the likelihood of a coordinated or self-serving motive.
For example, in United States v. Bailey, 581 F.2d 341 (3d Cir. 1978), the court noted that corroborating testimony from independent witnesses could significantly enhance credibility and probative value. Similarly, Federal Rule of Evidence 404(b) allows prior bad acts to be admitted in limited circumstances, precisely because independent, consistent reports can establish patterns that are unlikely to result from mere coincidence or collusion.
Yes, “expert witness” testimony sends people to prison all the time. If you don’t know what that is, they are state lackeys labeled experts in whatever field by the prosecuting attorney to go up and lie about why the defendant is guilty in their “expert” opinion.
Not usually means yes in the right circumstances, you know, like 28 independent reports of rape against a convicted rapist who brags about taking sexual advantage of girls.
Also, yes it does all the time, they have “expert witnesses” whose job is entirely to get people convicted based solely on testimony from people who had nothing to do with the situation the people are on trial for.
At least 28 women/girls have come forward, and he has been convicted of rape and bragged about taking advantage of women, his best friend ran an industry of rape, how much more do you fucking need? Stop defending a rapist.
That’s certainly proof of character, but it’s not evidence. There’s no way you can frame this that doesn’t end in being thrown out of court without something substantial that puts him there and committing the act.
Blood samples, photographs, surveillance video, admission, etc… these things are proof.
Prior convictions won’t count as evidence. But they help with m proof of character- which can only help the prosecution, but doesn’t close a case.
Imagine if I didn’t like you and I got say, 28 people to accuse you of harassment here on lemmy. As a result, you get banned. Is that fair? Now, imagine you DID harass me and 27 other people. As a result you get banned. Is that fair?
If you’re honest, you’d answer no to the first, and yes to the second.
And that is why we don’t allow accusations to serve as proof.
Wanting something bad enough is not a legal precedent. Everyone has rights.
Are you saying that no rape victim ever received justice? Or maybe you’re willing to change your statement so that it presets in a way that says you’re pissed of that just HE is able to get away with it.
Because if it’s the latter, understand that you’re willing to change our entire legal system to prosecute anyone based on accusation alone-
For all the rapist defense rhetoric fucks out there in these comments, and there are a lot of you.
Circumstantial evidence is valid evidence. Let’s maybe consider that, maybe, just maybe, of at least 28 women coming forward, with one confirmed rape conviction, that he has raped multiple women/girls. Just fucking maybe. This isn’t about your brother’s/cousin’s/dude from high school’s crazy ex-wife with a brain tumor, it’s about the president of the United States, maybe hold it to a different standard and stop painting everything with the same brush.
There, done. Why isn’t he behind bars?
Oh, so that’s why he isn’t behind bars.
No one here is in defense of rapists. Your accusations is exactly why we don’t just “believe women.” Accusations aren’t proof of guilt.
Also, there’s a thing in law that’s called “precedent”.
If you allow accusations to be accepted as legal proof of a thing, the floodgates open to allow this precedent to be applied to ALL things.
We don’t like our boss? Let’s all accuse him of rape! Boom! Prison.
We don’t like the head of our HOA? Let’s all accuse her of embezzlement! Boom! Prison!
There’s a reason proof is required. And it protects everyone. Even the bad guys.
In your scenarios, all of the plaintiffs are related to the accused in a similar way and would have a common incentive to make the accusation. That kind of situation naturally raises concerns about collusion or bias. By contrast, when multiple independent and unconnected individuals come forward with similar accusations, the evidentiary weight is very different. Courts recognize that corroboration from unrelated parties strengthens credibility, because it reduces the likelihood of a coordinated or self-serving motive.
For example, in United States v. Bailey, 581 F.2d 341 (3d Cir. 1978), the court noted that corroborating testimony from independent witnesses could significantly enhance credibility and probative value. Similarly, Federal Rule of Evidence 404(b) allows prior bad acts to be admitted in limited circumstances, precisely because independent, consistent reports can establish patterns that are unlikely to result from mere coincidence or collusion.
Thanks for bring up an example of precedence. It helps a lot.
And look at that statement:
could significantly enhance credibility.
It’s not evidence to lead to conviction.
Can testimony alone lead to a conviction?
Yes, “expert witness” testimony sends people to prison all the time. If you don’t know what that is, they are state lackeys labeled experts in whatever field by the prosecuting attorney to go up and lie about why the defendant is guilty in their “expert” opinion.
No, not usually.
But it does happen sometimes under specific circumstances. So if it happens sometimes, there is precedent.
I encourage you to go find some sexual assault cases where nothing but testimony led to a conviction and give them a read. You might be surprised.
Here, I’ll help by offering one for you to read:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/E._Jean_Carroll_v._Donald_J._Trump#%3A~%3Atext%3DIn_November_2022%2C_Carroll_filed%2Cand_his_October_2022_deposition.%3Fwprov=sfla1
Not usually means yes in the right circumstances, you know, like 28 independent reports of rape against a convicted rapist who brags about taking sexual advantage of girls.
Also, yes it does all the time, they have “expert witnesses” whose job is entirely to get people convicted based solely on testimony from people who had nothing to do with the situation the people are on trial for.
“Great job, that definitely shows he’s a rapist, but we still can’t say he’s a rapist!” - You, that’s what you sound like.
I thought you said you were going to block me, whatever happened to that?
I’ll just copy and paste this again.
At least 28 women/girls have come forward, and he has been convicted of rape and bragged about taking advantage of women, his best friend ran an industry of rape, how much more do you fucking need? Stop defending a rapist.
I’ll just copy and paste this again;
That’s certainly proof of character, but it’s not evidence. There’s no way you can frame this that doesn’t end in being thrown out of court without something substantial that puts him there and committing the act.
Blood samples, photographs, surveillance video, admission, etc… these things are proof.
Prior convictions won’t count as evidence. But they help with m proof of character- which can only help the prosecution, but doesn’t close a case.
Imagine if I didn’t like you and I got say, 28 people to accuse you of harassment here on lemmy. As a result, you get banned. Is that fair? Now, imagine you DID harass me and 27 other people. As a result you get banned. Is that fair?
If you’re honest, you’d answer no to the first, and yes to the second.
And that is why we don’t allow accusations to serve as proof.
Wanting something bad enough is not a legal precedent. Everyone has rights.
Everyone other than his victims, it would seem.
Are you saying that no rape victim ever received justice? Or maybe you’re willing to change your statement so that it presets in a way that says you’re pissed of that just HE is able to get away with it.
Because if it’s the latter, understand that you’re willing to change our entire legal system to prosecute anyone based on accusation alone-
Just to incarcerate one person.
Are you being obtuse or are you that stupid?
I’m blocking you now. You’re here to waste time.
You’re here to waste lives.
So you saying trump is not rapist? Or you saying trump is rapist but we are not sure? Are you not sure that he is rapist? Are you dumb?
You ask those questions after reading my explanation, and have the gaul to ask me if I’m dumb?
It’s a valid question.
Exactly 👏👏👏