Anyone speaking of secession - please, read history. We do not want to do that again, I don’t care what you believe in, it is a terrible idea. Please think it through beyond how admittedly awesome it would be in theory alone.
It’s a terrible idea, but so is invading Greenland, Canada, or Panama. We don’t do such things anymore, read history why, but yet, here we are.
This is how a possible secession starts. Trump might prohibit California from doing this because it goes against his masters plan of destroying the US, California doesn’t want to become a husk of it’s former self and pushes through.
If California were to secede, it would immediately break the rest of the US. All the red states have been so poorly managed for decades that they near fully rely in handouts from successful states like California. With California gone, other blue and successful states would likely follow because they won’t be able to pay the bill for those states either, splitting the US into a successful new country and dirt poor third world type theocratic dictatorship nation. Maybe it wouldn’t be the worst thing, let the christo fascists live in the hell hole that they want
Secession(s) will likely include a civil war, and right now with the decade of trump shit causing division and chaos, I think that too isn’t too far fetched anymore. There is nothing as horrible as neighbor fighting neighbors, ask Yugoslavia, but here we are in Trump’s world.
How would a state secede from the US? Like, what’s the actual process?
The state government would put forwards a local movement to secede from the US, and if it actually passed the federal government would butt in and go “you can’t secede, that’s completely illegal and unconstitutional” (it is), at which point the state would either go “oh well” and stand down or say “go suck eggs” and continue trying to secede, which the federal government would treat as rebellion or insurrection.
So, easy then! We know insurrections aren’t a big deal and have no real consequences. Full steam ahead!
/s just in case
Even if the federal government says “okay”. They may actually turn around and pretend it never happened… or they can start a war with them.
There is no process. States cannot just up and say “see ya” on their own, we fought a war over that.
If the people felt that it would be OK for a state to leave, the proper thing to do would be to pass an amendment stating a process, and then the state would do it. There would be a lot of details to hammer out: does the State get to keep Federal property (like military bases)? Does it inherit a share of the deficit? What happens to deferred US taxes on things like 401k accounts?
IMHO it would take so long to hammer that stuff out that it’s basically impossible.
In short: War. I’m not being hyperbolic either.
just secede already.
Fuck companies who do that. United they shall fall.
Why would they do that? They gain nothing from that.
Gain nothing? They pay more in federal taxes than they recieve. They’d probably be better off
And they would have to turn around and spend it on their own military because they would lose the military that all 50 states funded together. I never used to be believe in the threat of eastern aggression, but it becomes more and more obvious every day that they can never see the USA bleed. And that’s in the assumption the hyper-aggressive Trump admin does nothing about a secession.
Plus, they’ve already got more than enough justification to withhold federal income taxes and tariffs, the sitting president is violating the constitution and wasn’t even eligible to run in the first place.
Instead of carving ourselves up and removing blue seats from congress we could be uniting against Trump.
They have a military. It’s called the national guard. But yeah the question of secession was settled back in the 1860s.
Short of a massive and sustained general strike or a violent revolution nothing is changing in this country dem or republican. Even the democrats are right wing.
The national guard is mobilized to address state emergencies and support the military abroad. Any state’s national guard is woefully inadequate to defend against foreign threats
As much as I hate Newsom and the democrats, secession from a lunatic presidency that is ready to tank the global market for the interest of the rich elite would be a big step forward for Americans. Trump wants big government. He wants the entire country to adhere to the right wing populists and ultra rich. Yea no I’d say the Californians gain a fuck ton from that.
What Trump is doing is illegal, there is plenty of justification for California to simply respond by doing equally illegal things like denying the feds and withholding taxes.
Removing Cali congressmen is the opposite of opposing his admin.
As i read this, i am remembered of Newsom meeting Trump, after he refused to help with Californian wildfires.
Why they all leaning forward except Newsom? lol
Fake news. Some journo hack used photoshop. Here’s the original, with Trup standing true and strong despite them all being on a hillside.
Skills mate, you got them. Nice one.
People misinterpret this image. Newsom isn’t point at Trump, he’s keeping the stack of people from falling over.
Smooth criminals?
Smoothbrain criminals. “America has been hit by…struck by a smoothbrain criminal!”
[Chorus]
America, are you okay? (I don’t know)
Will you tell us that you’re okay? (I don’t know)
There’s a felon at the window (I don’t know)
Then Trump struck you, a crescendo America? (I don’t know)
Trump came onto your apartment (I don’t know)
Left white stains on the carpet (I don’t know why, baby)
And then she ran into the bedroom (Help me)
She were struck down
It was your doom America (Dag gone it)
Newsom’s gravity powers are pulling them in. They can’t help it
They’re clearly exiting the plane and trying to keep the line moving.
Would be fun to watch companies from other states bypass the tariffs by buying California products.
Then of course, Trump will propose tariffs on a State.
It would be hilarious if only red states had tariffs with the rest of the world.
All hail The New California Republic. But in all seriousness, it wouldn’t surprise me if the United States has a balkanization event happen in the near future.
I don’t get why Oregon and Washington haven’t jumped on that bandwagon. Imagine the entire west coast working together. All Western seaports.
There is a Cascadia Independence movement but it’s not widely talked about.
The US does not need balkanization.
We have a single region that has been rebellious and trying to corrupt and destroy the rest of the union since the founding, because they cannot see any governmental or religious structure as legitimate unless it is founded on the principles of racism. This is their own words.
Lincoln was wrong to readmit the south, we should have let Sherman finish then build a wall around them, while letting any slaves who wanted to escape do so.
Either that or we need to restart reconstruction today with absolute brutality.
Before they committed treason against the US alone, this time they allied with Russia to bring us down.
I dont think the lines are the same anymore. Social media and 24/7 news has given people in plenty of northern regions the same viewpoints. A civil war would not be north vs. south. it would be neighbor vs neighbor
I always hear this.
I am brown and grew up in the Midwest.
Then my family moved to the south.
This is like comparing Canadians who care about hockey with the Khmer Rouge exterminating much of their population.
The south is just infinitely worse in literally every way.
there are a lot of nice people in the south. there are a lot of brown people in the south. you think everyone needs to suffer brutality for what the worst do?
It seems to be the norm that the many suffer for the actions of the few.
In the Midwest there are bad people too.
The difference?
In the Midwest when a racist is being a racist, people say shit, they stand up to them!
In the south the bystanders just laugh, at worst they laugh nervously.
Which is why it’s a vile and corrupt society.
Police yourself, or don’t be surprised to be judged as evil.
We have a single region that has been rebellious and trying to corrupt and destroy the rest of the union since the founding
Isn’t a ton of the current Trump administration rot coming from Silicon Valley?
Isn’t Silicon Valley in California?
Lincoln was wrong to readmit the south
The South was under the Reconstruction plan, complete with Marshall Law and Freedman’s Bureaus and all sorts of additional federal oversight, untilThe Compromise of 1877 gave Rutherford B. Hayes the presidency at the cost of his soul.
Lincoln didn’t simply readmit the South. He readmitted 9 million enslaved Americans as proper first class citizens. And the initial wave of democratization gave birth to a brief but generally optimistic egalitarian glimpse of a potential future.
Lincoln’s big mistake was not putting Smedly Butler into his VP seat. Letting the country revert to Andrew Johnson was the big blunder. One that Grant had to spend two terms mopping up.
But that’s all distant history. The modern fascist presidency is born out of Manhattan Island. The modern Texas/Florida/Ohio Axis of Evil is a product of Yale Business School. Stanford Alumni are fucking us up far more today than some Daughters of the Confederacy could have dreamed.
This isn’t a North/South problem. It’s a turf war between extractive industry and the professional class.
Yeah, because if there’s two things we know silicon valley loves it’s the core issues of the Trump administrafion:
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Immigration restrictions
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Tariffs
He was voted in purely about the south, who are not only fascists to the core (if what they consider to be Christo-fascists).
The thing is: their religion, the southern Baptist church, was founded because they wanted a religion whose core dogma was that slavery was a commandment from God. Hence their basing the Sbc around the curse of Ham justifying slavery. The nazis themselves based the Nuremberg Laws off Jim crow, only without the 1 drop rule.
This is 100% the south, the restriction of women’s rights, the anti-lgbt, racism, isolation ism.
They’ve been sold that Russia is their best ally because it is the last True (read: white) Christian Nation fighting against the atheist and Muslim hordes who have infested Europe.
Silicon valley doesn’t want any of this bullshit, they just want less regulation. This has been a nightmare for them, Europe is starting their own competitors and regulating the cloud providers.
Silicon valley is smart, this whole thing has the backwards inbred balls-over-brains energy of the south.
Show me one Manhattan anyone who thinks those tariffs are a good idea.
Super popular in the south though, finally those rich northerners will have to pay them to do the work, instead of buying stuff from the dirty Mexicans.
there’s two things we know silicon valley loves it’s the core issues of the Trump administrafion:
Immigration restrictionsTariffsGo pick up a copy of The Network State
Are you fucking insane?
The ceos of most tech companies are Asian!
Google, Microsoft, Nvidia.
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*Benjamin Butler
Ack, excuse me
It’s cool, I love Smedley as well, greatest Marine ever.
Reminds me of east and west germany, even still today, one side is poorer than the other, which fostered new radicalism.
And also where i live, Quebec, poorer rural regions control the elections.
Exactly, the difference is in east Germany after the war they mostly dealt with the nazis.
In the south they gave them a timeout for 10 years then let them take power again.
Lol no they didn’t deal with the nazis in East Germany. They were pretty quickly persecuted if they came out, but as long as they stayed quiet and clamied they wanted socialism, nothing happened to them.
And then after the fall of the east block, all of the nazis in eastern Germany no longer had to be quiet and there were also many nazis from the west who helped spread it even further while there was a power vacuum and nothing was done against it.
Well they were quiet for a while.
Damn, they’re coming back? And of course with Russian funding.
And so it moves closer to the handmaids tale every day
I lived in the south, if they could read they’d consider it a fantasy utopia.
While I agree with telling Trump to go lick Elon’s balls, states are specifically forbidden from entering into trade agreements with foreign countries by the Constitution. To do this, California would need to be willing to secede from the Union. I’m okay with it.
The best I could tell from the article was that all he was doing was essentially lobbying foriegn countries to tailor their responses so that they hurt california less than other states. I can’t see any law blocking that. From what I could tell he wasn’t even offering anything real in exchange.
California produces 10% of American agricultural needs. If they secede it would be way worse on the economy than these tariffs.
I think if California were to secede, Oregon and Washington probably would too. A lot of blue states that border Canada would also probably Jump ship. New York and Michigan might secede too. Those 5 states make up almost 30% of America’s economy and are the center of very lucrative industries like the movie industry, automotive industry, electronics and software industries, the global financial industry. Those 5 states would do just fine without the United States but the United states would be an unimportant backwater without them.
I’m genuinely curious on how realistic this is… I can’t imagine it’s a simple process, but like what would need to happen for California to become it’s own country?
At the moment, California is taking signatures for studying a “CALexit” plan. It is about 500,000 signatures by July for a successful petition. After that, California starts to study the costs, opportunities, logistics, and other aspects of leaving the union.
depending on which produce item its significantly higher
Texas couldn’t secede, probably because it’s a red state…how amazing would it be if California became it’s own country with actual progressive laws. I for one would allow it. Let them become Canada, Mexico or even it’s own. Do it Cali!
You’re implying the constitution has any weight right now (it doesn’t)
I’d say fuckin do it
And it’s the same for the European union. European states can’t get trade agreements by themselves. So when you read “Italy is ready to talk with trump” is just sucking dick
Merkel had to explain that to Trump 11 times last time he was president. I bet he forgot it again.
Not really a matter of forgetting. Trump was a leading advocate for Brexit. He wants to see the EU dissolved.
Putin does anyway and thus so does Trump
Let’s do it.
Trump has got another great idea. A tax of 1.5 million dollars for each ship made in China that will dock at any American port, or 1 million if the ship is not made in china but the shipper fleet has a majority of Chinese ships.
So, off before they did like California, Panama, Louisiana, new York, those stops will increase the price of shipping by 4.5 million dollars.
Trump thinks that in this way, in a couple weeks, shipyards will reopen in the states and everyone will buy American ships. Because it takes a couple days to build an oil tanker
Result:
They’ll just unload the goods in Canada or Mexico then use trains/trucks. For oil and coal and wheat and other stuff that can’t be easily transported by land without ax existing infrastructure, that’s an additional 20% cost on top of tariffs. Inflation go go go
Yeah Trump wants the US to be a great shipbuilder again… but for that you need materials (steel), workers who want to do that sort of job( he’s deporting a lot of people) and skill to manufacture ships…
He thinks by taxing countries or companies, they will go to the US, but they won’t, and if they do it takes time and a lot of investment…
EU is already trying to specifically target products from red states with tariffs.
That’s not going to work in practice. The US economy is even more tangled under the hood than it is internationally.
Might as well say you’re taking a called shot on someone’s left ventrical, because you don’t want to hurt any other part of their body.
I’d prefer that they at least try to target them
Source? (No doubt, just looking forward tobreading more)
Not sure what media you prefer, find a nice article here: https://www.ecosia.org/search?q=eu+targetting+red+states
I think that’s the nicest “LMGTFY” kind of response I’ve seen. Kudos to you, my friend.
This is based on a quote “look at new opportunities to expand trade” and a tweet “California is here and ready to talk.” How definitive do those two things sound? How definitive does Newsweek’s title sound?
Newsweek is a gossip rag.
Newsweek is pretty close to a tabloid these days. They are a tad better than the NY Post, but not by much.
Holy shit, my prediction model forecast this. 🍿 This is actually a major step toward derailing this coup.
Or starting a civil war.
If it ends with us cutting Trumpistan/the Neo-Confederacy off, I’m good. Just hope we have enough time to get decent people out of the Neo-Confederacy.
Good. There is no point in being part of a government that doesn’t believe in governance. Here’s hoping that other Blue States join a compact with California.
I’m in a blue state, and I say, kick all the MAGA out first. Forget em!
Trump has been withholding fema money allocated to California. They are stealing disaster funds. He also wasted billions of gallons of water during the la , for a headline, pretending that he did something. Wasting that water when we have a wet/dry season is detrimental for farming. Destroying food supply/ water supply In reality that’s attrition and is an act of war, he is attacking Californians extra hard, but he also attacking all Americans.
Glad to hear, im Canadian and i have no problem buying American products from certain states.
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Every place in the world has douchebags in it. I’m sure that the share of douchebags even among California voters is actually much larger than 38.3%, once you figure in the assholes who voted for someone else beside Trump (not to mention the people who didn’t vote at all). And you guys have your own Trump, Poilievre. Every country has assholes. Don’t forget that.
We did fix our shit, the shit we can’t fix is the south, nobody can, they are a shame on the country.
I don’t understand why the north won and still allowed the Confederate flag, war criminals to be heroes name bases after war criminals. It boogles my mind and is probably one of the reasons America is where it is. The north never actually won just dominated for awhile.
It is because we generally don’t obsess about the south like they obsess about themselves and the north.
We have shit to do.
Like an unemployed drunk staying at home, screaming at the TV and beating his wife because their life didn’t turn out well.
While we have reasons not to be so trash.
38.3% of voters.
Not 38.3% of the population.
Pretty significant difference.
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Thats way less than most places in the US and less than fucking doug ford got in ontario. Less than Pierre was polling canada wide too. So yeah, I’d rather trade with them than say fucking alberta which is also way higher conservative poll numbers.
If you prefer to trade with California rather than Alberta, you basically have a brain maga.
In what way? Alberta is politcally basically the polar opposite to my beliefs, and is holding the entire country back. California is still not nearly left enough for my tastes, but aside from some outlying rural areas generally is much more favorable to my political views. With the exception of trade barriers and the fact that money going to california still impacts the US GDP, generally speaking Id rather give my money to people with similar beliefs as myself, especily if those people are trying to take a stand against trump/other fascist politicians and not licking their boots and huffing oil fumes like danielle smith.
Which is not a majority, there’s more blue voters in Texas than Republicans in California.
I don’t think OP cares about it being a majority or not. 38% voters is too many for their liking. And honestly, you can’t blame 'em.
Secede and then we can trade :)
If they secede you will definitely not be trading with either half for a long time.
Better than the current situation honestly. Both being preoccupied is better than Trump’s admirations of Canadian minerals
I honestly think you’re soapboxing for clout.
It’s good that everyone is weaning themselves off American products, but you’re fooling yourself if you really think America having a civil war won’t make your life as a Canadian objectively worse.
I’m of the opinion that despite America not learning from fascism’s rise to power, most of the rest of the world did, and will back each other up much better than they did 100 years ago. In other words, we’re never annexing Canada or your minerals, we’re merely making life hell for ourselves (and anyone else who depends on our economy). Imagine the Third Reich except no invasions, just an internal Holocaust. I think that’s the worse case scenario. Canada isn’t invading to save our minorities, same as nobody invaded Germany to save theirs.
Maybe I’m being a bit dramatic, yeah, but we’re living in really dramatic times.
we’re never annexing Canada or your minerals
I mean, a lot of people didn’t expect Trump to tear down the American government within months of getting into power either. With Trump stating that he wants to annex Canada “through economic means” and then immediately attacking us with ridiculous tariffs, it seems like he’s following through on that. I don’t think he’ll hurt us as bad economically as he’s hoping though, so I don’t think him declaring actual war on us out of the picture. It honestly seems like he’s already trying to warm his base up to the idea with us being “a national security threat” and “overrun by cartels”.
Idk, just try to picture the POTUS repeatedly saying he’s going to annex your home for months on end, and then try not to get a little bit on edge.
Edit:
America having a civil war [will] make your life as a Canadian objectively worse
Yeah I admit you’re most definitely right about this. It really wouldn’t be a good time
Not if you get all the nuclear fallout.
I think I’d rather be nuked than be lead by the orange man ngl
I doubt that’s true
I don’t know if you understand the pettiness and absolute disdain of the idea of being American that Canadians have. I live in Ottawa so I would be in the city that gets nuked if it came to that
Ok
Im not an American but can they actually do this legally?
I’m not a British Subject, but can the Colonists actually go to war against the King?
Depends on how legally you need it. They also have marijuana by way of nonenforcement.
Legally? No. But you can’t secede legally either so there is a fuzzy line there somewhere should they start down that road.
I mean, I guess we’ll find out together
